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	<title>Comments on: Are beam frames making a comeback?</title>
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	<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/?utm_source=rss&#038;utm_medium=rss&#038;utm_campaign=are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback</link>
	<description>The blog about industrial design in the bike industry</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Ride your bike &#171; Circus Politicus</title>
		<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/comment-page-1/#comment-28169</link>
		<dc:creator>Ride your bike &#171; Circus Politicus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jul 2012 13:14:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bicycledesign.net/?p=3301#comment-28169</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] supers beaux vélos pour aller très vite. Attention à la [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] supers beaux vélos pour aller très vite. Attention à la [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Kimmo</title>
		<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/comment-page-1/#comment-27799</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jul 2012 15:26:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bicycledesign.net/?p=3301#comment-27799</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hmm, no underlining either. Oh well, got it right the first time I guess.

Which I&#039;ll have to get good at to post around here it seems, otherwise I&#039;ll look like a &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.bikeforums.net/search.php?searchid=5941352&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;spammy mcspammerson&lt;/a&gt; replying to myself all the time.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm, no underlining either. Oh well, got it right the first time I guess.</p>
<p>Which I&#8217;ll have to get good at to post around here it seems, otherwise I&#8217;ll look like a <a href="http://www.bikeforums.net/search.php?searchid=5941352" rel="nofollow">spammy mcspammerson</a> replying to myself all the time.</p>
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		<title>By: Kimmo</title>
		<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/comment-page-1/#comment-27798</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jul 2012 15:17:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bicycledesign.net/?p=3301#comment-27798</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[No editing is a bummer.

*beautiful*]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No editing is a bummer.</p>
<p>*beautiful*</p>
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		<title>By: Kimmo</title>
		<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/comment-page-1/#comment-27797</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jul 2012 15:14:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bicycledesign.net/?p=3301#comment-27797</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;Check out the &lt;a href=&quot;http://pearsonbikes.com/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Pearson Bikes&lt;/a&gt; website&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&lt;a href=&quot;http://pearsonbikes.com/portfolio/2.jpg&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Lolwut&lt;/a&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Check out the <a href="http://pearsonbikes.com/" rel="nofollow">Pearson Bikes</a> website</p></blockquote>
<p><a href="http://pearsonbikes.com/portfolio/2.jpg" rel="nofollow">Lolwut</a></p>
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		<title>By: Kimmo</title>
		<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/comment-page-1/#comment-27793</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jul 2012 14:00:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bicycledesign.net/?p=3301#comment-27793</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Beam bikes are win. &lt;i&gt;F***&lt;/i&gt; the UCI; damn them and their retrotech fetish to hell.

Leaving aside aerodynamics for a moment, such a beam design craps all over the diamond frame from a simple engineering perspective. The refinements and tradeoffs between stiffness and comfort managed with the diamond frame up to this point are all rendered a sad joke when you remove the seat tube and seatstays. Now, you&#039;re free to make the chainstays deep as possible for maximum beef around the BB. And given that it&#039;s a natural for a beam bike to have a separate beam, that introduces a whole world of sizing flexibility, and makes it feasible to offer optimised off-the shelf frames for folks who may be short but heavy and powerful, or tall but light. You could have four or five frame sizes in two different weights (perhaps with a longer head tube option), and maybe as many options for the beam, et voila. But the best part of all? No more futzing around with chainbreakers or special links - just remove a jockey wheel and your intact chain is free. That alone is reason enough to run with any excuse to get rid of seatstays.

Then there&#039;s the fact that it&#039;s &lt;b&gt;simpler&lt;/b&gt; than a diamond frame. And if it&#039;s simpler and it does the job better, it&#039;s more &lt;i&gt;elegant&lt;/i&gt;. And if it&#039;s more elegant, it&#039;s more [u]beautiful[/u]. Simple as that; if it looks ugly to you, it just means you&#039;re not looking at it right.

As for aerodynamics, there are a few thoughts that seem obvious to me... first, air in the region of the seat tube is already turbulent, so my feeling is that changing the silhouette of the bike around here (as viewed from the side) perhaps isn&#039;t going to do a very great deal... it strikes me as diminishing returns stuff. However, seatstays hang out in the breeze, and the brake... and by basically removing everything behind the head tube except the back wheel, it does seem possible there&#039;s quite a bit less turbulence involved for the air passing between the rider&#039;s legs. I imagine the aerodynamics of the rear wheel would matter a little more on a beam bike. At a guess, I&#039;d say the aerodynamics of the Z1-Eleven here would have to be at least as good or better than the best diamond frames, but probably not quite as good as a Z frame like the Lotus Sport 110, which was designed with aero as priority #1.

That&#039;s my 2c.... you might not think such armchair musings are worth even that, but I&#039;m pretty sure I haven&#039;t gone out on a limb anywhere.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Beam bikes are win. <i>F***</i> the UCI; damn them and their retrotech fetish to hell.</p>
<p>Leaving aside aerodynamics for a moment, such a beam design craps all over the diamond frame from a simple engineering perspective. The refinements and tradeoffs between stiffness and comfort managed with the diamond frame up to this point are all rendered a sad joke when you remove the seat tube and seatstays. Now, you&#8217;re free to make the chainstays deep as possible for maximum beef around the BB. And given that it&#8217;s a natural for a beam bike to have a separate beam, that introduces a whole world of sizing flexibility, and makes it feasible to offer optimised off-the shelf frames for folks who may be short but heavy and powerful, or tall but light. You could have four or five frame sizes in two different weights (perhaps with a longer head tube option), and maybe as many options for the beam, et voila. But the best part of all? No more futzing around with chainbreakers or special links &#8211; just remove a jockey wheel and your intact chain is free. That alone is reason enough to run with any excuse to get rid of seatstays.</p>
<p>Then there&#8217;s the fact that it&#8217;s <b>simpler</b> than a diamond frame. And if it&#8217;s simpler and it does the job better, it&#8217;s more <i>elegant</i>. And if it&#8217;s more elegant, it&#8217;s more [u]beautiful[/u]. Simple as that; if it looks ugly to you, it just means you&#8217;re not looking at it right.</p>
<p>As for aerodynamics, there are a few thoughts that seem obvious to me&#8230; first, air in the region of the seat tube is already turbulent, so my feeling is that changing the silhouette of the bike around here (as viewed from the side) perhaps isn&#8217;t going to do a very great deal&#8230; it strikes me as diminishing returns stuff. However, seatstays hang out in the breeze, and the brake&#8230; and by basically removing everything behind the head tube except the back wheel, it does seem possible there&#8217;s quite a bit less turbulence involved for the air passing between the rider&#8217;s legs. I imagine the aerodynamics of the rear wheel would matter a little more on a beam bike. At a guess, I&#8217;d say the aerodynamics of the Z1-Eleven here would have to be at least as good or better than the best diamond frames, but probably not quite as good as a Z frame like the Lotus Sport 110, which was designed with aero as priority #1.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s my 2c&#8230;. you might not think such armchair musings are worth even that, but I&#8217;m pretty sure I haven&#8217;t gone out on a limb anywhere.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron George</title>
		<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/comment-page-1/#comment-27511</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron George</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 03:41:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bicycledesign.net/?p=3301#comment-27511</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I would love to see some aerodynamics testing done against a comparable bike that had a seat tube. Perhaps the best way would be a CFD simulation ? I don&#039;t know if comparing to a other TT bikes like Specialized or Shiv will give you reasonable conclusions, I mean you&#039;d have to be pretty sure you&#039;re only seeing the effects of a missing seat tube when you do that sort of comparison, and other features on the Shiv or Cervelo should not affect results.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would love to see some aerodynamics testing done against a comparable bike that had a seat tube. Perhaps the best way would be a CFD simulation ? I don&#8217;t know if comparing to a other TT bikes like Specialized or Shiv will give you reasonable conclusions, I mean you&#8217;d have to be pretty sure you&#8217;re only seeing the effects of a missing seat tube when you do that sort of comparison, and other features on the Shiv or Cervelo should not affect results.</p>
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		<title>By: Enrico</title>
		<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/comment-page-1/#comment-27191</link>
		<dc:creator>Enrico</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Jun 2012 11:52:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bicycledesign.net/?p=3301#comment-27191</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[aerodynamic? is there anything better than a &quot;good&quot; recumbent bike? ... even without fairings]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>aerodynamic? is there anything better than a &#8220;good&#8221; recumbent bike? &#8230; even without fairings</p>
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		<title>By: Hot New Urban Commuter &#171; Urban Velo</title>
		<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/comment-page-1/#comment-27187</link>
		<dc:creator>Hot New Urban Commuter &#171; Urban Velo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Jun 2012 05:52:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bicycledesign.net/?p=3301#comment-27187</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] kidding. Via Bicycle Design.           Published by Urban Jeff on June 19, 2012 in News &amp; Views. 0 [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] kidding. Via Bicycle Design.           Published by Urban Jeff on June 19, 2012 in News &amp; Views. 0 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Christian Wendenburg</title>
		<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/comment-page-1/#comment-27148</link>
		<dc:creator>Christian Wendenburg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Jun 2012 22:07:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bicycledesign.net/?p=3301#comment-27148</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Also, by the way....I also stand behind 3T Ventus aerobar, Rotor TT cranks, Nokon cables, KMC chains, Look Keo Blade Ti pedals, and Simkins Eggs brakes.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also, by the way&#8230;.I also stand behind 3T Ventus aerobar, Rotor TT cranks, Nokon cables, KMC chains, Look Keo Blade Ti pedals, and Simkins Eggs brakes.</p>
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		<title>By: Christian Wendenburg</title>
		<link>http://bicycledesign.net/2012/06/are-beam-frames-making-a-comeback/comment-page-1/#comment-27147</link>
		<dc:creator>Christian Wendenburg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Jun 2012 22:01:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bicycledesign.net/?p=3301#comment-27147</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I just counted the races I have done on my Pearson GC-1 Concept since 2009. I have done 10 full Ironman races on your frame. So, that&#039;s 1120 miles (1814Km) of racing. That does NOT include the additional number of 70.3 races I have done since 2009 on the frame. So, anyone who wants to know how well your frames hold up, can contact me for validation.
I stand behind Graeme&#039;s frames 100%.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just counted the races I have done on my Pearson GC-1 Concept since 2009. I have done 10 full Ironman races on your frame. So, that&#8217;s 1120 miles (1814Km) of racing. That does NOT include the additional number of 70.3 races I have done since 2009 on the frame. So, anyone who wants to know how well your frames hold up, can contact me for validation.<br />
I stand behind Graeme&#8217;s frames 100%.</p>
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